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When the Legends Die

  • 1972
  • PG
  • 1h 47m
IMDb RATING
6.3/10
591
YOUR RATING
Richard Widmark, Frederic Forrest, Tillman Box, and John War Eagle in When the Legends Die (1972)
Contemporary WesternDramaWestern

A young, rebellious Ute Indian joins the rodeo circuit and falls in with a drunken mentor who teaches him the ways of the ring and the world.A young, rebellious Ute Indian joins the rodeo circuit and falls in with a drunken mentor who teaches him the ways of the ring and the world.A young, rebellious Ute Indian joins the rodeo circuit and falls in with a drunken mentor who teaches him the ways of the ring and the world.

  • Director
    • Stuart Millar
  • Writers
    • Hal Borland
    • Robert Dozier
  • Stars
    • Richard Widmark
    • Frederic Forrest
    • Luana Anders
  • See production info at IMDbPro
  • IMDb RATING
    6.3/10
    591
    YOUR RATING
    • Director
      • Stuart Millar
    • Writers
      • Hal Borland
      • Robert Dozier
    • Stars
      • Richard Widmark
      • Frederic Forrest
      • Luana Anders
    • 10User reviews
    • 7Critic reviews
  • See production info at IMDbPro
  • See production info at IMDbPro
    • Awards
      • 1 nomination total

    Photos14

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    Top cast28

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    Richard Widmark
    Richard Widmark
    • Red Dillon
    Frederic Forrest
    Frederic Forrest
    • Tom Black Bull
    Luana Anders
    Luana Anders
    • Mary
    Vito Scotti
    Vito Scotti
    • Meo (Dillon's caretaker)
    Herbert Nelson
    Herbert Nelson
    • Dr. Wilson
    John War Eagle
    John War Eagle
    • Blue Elk
    John Gruber
    • Clyde 'Tex' Walker
    Garry Walberg
    Garry Walberg
    • School Superintendant
    Jack Mullaney
    Jack Mullaney
    • Gas Station Attendant
    Malcolm Curley
    • Benny Grayback (school principal)
    Roy Engel
    Roy Engel
    • Sam Turner
    Rex Holman
    Rex Holman
    • Neil Swenson
    Mel Gallagher
    • Cowboy
    Tillman Box
    • Young Tom Black Bull
    Sondra Pratt
    • Angie (girl who picks up Tom)
    Verne Muehlstedt
    • Harold
    Evan Stevens
    • George
    John Renforth
    • Old Man
    • Director
      • Stuart Millar
    • Writers
      • Hal Borland
      • Robert Dozier
    • All cast & crew
    • Production, box office & more at IMDbPro

    User reviews10

    6.3591
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    Featured reviews

    7helpless_dancer

    Rednecks, rodeo, redskins, rotgut, & Richard

    Widmark plays the drunken, former rodeo rider to perfection, & Frederick Forrest does admirably as the put upon young bull rider. I felt most of the other players were of the Grade B variety, as was this production in many ways. Not as good as "J.W. Coop".
    7bkoganbing

    "You Taught Me Everything I Know."

    In the War Wagon, Howard Keel who plays Levi Walking Bear, derides his fellow Indians constantly saying how he's learned to live in the white man's world and beat him at his own game. When the Legends Die is a film about a contemporary Ute Indian who tries to do just that and the effect it has on him.

    Fredric Forrest plays Thomas Black Bull, a young Ute who we first meet as a really backward kid, no education or social skills. After he sees him riding a bucking horse, old rodeo hand Richard Widmark takes him on as a protégé and young Mr. Black Bull becomes a champion saddle bronco rider.

    It's a profession and skill that he is beating the white man at his own game and making some good money in the process. It offends his sense of honor though, when Widmark now asks him to lose a few contests to make the odds better when he rides for real. It's the start of a break in their relationship.

    Fredric Forrest has had a strange career. When the Legends Die was his third film after two bit roles, this one gave him the billing of "introducing Fredric Forrest." This was the start of a whole bunch of times when good reviews prompted critics to say that Forrest was about to break out and become a big star. It never really happened for him though. Nevertheless his stoic performance as Thomas Black Bull turning into Killer Tom Black is accomplished a lot with some very good closeups on facial expressions. They say more than dialog with a good player.

    Richard Widmark plays Red Dillon, the old rodeo cowboy who becomes Forrest's manager/trainer. A whole lot like the way Robert Mitchum takes on young Arthur Kennedy in The Lusty Men. But we have a far bigger cultural and generational gap than there was in The Lusty Men. Despite his good old boy upbringing, Widmark develops a real affection for Forrest so their break up is pretty painful on both sides. Widmark in his performance as Dillon shows a seamier side of rodeo than other films about the sport never have. Of course Mr. Widmark shows it with style.

    The film is about how Thomas Black Bull resolves all the conflicts within him. If you see the film I think you'll agree he does it in the best way any of us could.

    This review is dedicated to young Ryan Dirteater of the Cherokee nation in Oklahoma and fast rising star of the Professional Bull Riders. Let Ryan avoid the pitfalls that Frederic Forrest has in this film.
    bwaynef

    The best of the early 70's "rodeo" movies

    Perhaps the best of the "aging rodeo cowboy" movies that mysteriously began to appear in 71-72 (Cliff Robertson's "J.W. Coop," Steve Inhat's "The Honkers" with James Coburn, and Sam Peckinpah's "Junior Bonner" with Steve McQueen). What makes the difference is Richard Widmark who seems more appropriately cast than the stars of the rival rodeo films. Widmark is excellent in perhaps the best of his later period roles.
    5henry8-3

    When the Legends Die

    Young Native American, Frederic Forrest, uneducated but with a great knowledge of horses is taken under the wing of alcoholic ageing rodeo expert, Richard Widmark who shows him how to make money out of his talents.

    Slow moving, but mature, intelligent drama looking at the relationship between the 2 men and how each changes each other. The key attraction here is the performances of the 2 leads with a young Forrest on top form in an early role and Widmark giving what must surely be in his top 10. He is terrific in this good guy role, mostly drunk and laughing throughout - a great pleasure to watch him.
    8whpratt1

    Widmark Can Play Any Role

    Over the years I have always enjoyed the great acting of Richard Widmark and remember his crazy laugh while he pushed a lady in a wheel chair down a flight of stairs in a 1940's film called,"Kiss of Death",'47, which started his career. In this picture, Richard Widmark,(Red Dillon),"Madigan",'68 plays a rough and tough character from the West who lives and dies for the love of showing off his great skills with horses. Red Dillon becomes great friends with Frederic Forrest,('Killer',Tom Black Bull),"The Two Jakes",'90, who is a Native American and is a great horse lover and wins big prizes in Rodeo's through out the West. If you love this type of film, you can't miss this great Classic film and the great performance of Richard Widmark.

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    Related interests

    Ben Foster and Chris Pine in Hell or High Water (2016)
    Contemporary Western
    Mahershala Ali and Alex R. Hibbert in Moonlight (2016)
    Drama
    John Wayne and Harry Carey Jr. in The Searchers (1956)
    Western

    Storyline

    Edit

    Did you know

    Edit
    • Trivia
      Based on the book of the same title.
    • Quotes

      "Killer" Tom Black Bull: Where's Meo?

      Red Dillon: Dead. Yep, he just come in here one night and said he was gonna die. The next morning he was dead. So I buried the old chili-eater out back there.

    • Crazy credits
      The 20th Century Fox logo plays without the fanfare.
    • Connections
      Referenced in My Husband, the Producer (1974)
    • Soundtracks
      When You Speak to the Kids
      Lyrics by Bo Goldman

      Music by Glenn Paxton

      Sung by Freddie Hart and Kenni Husky

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    FAQ15

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    Details

    Edit
    • Release date
      • December 1, 1972 (West Germany)
    • Country of origin
      • United States
    • Language
      • English
    • Also known as
      • The Taming of Tom Black Bull
    • Filming locations
      • Bayfield, Colorado, USA(The rodeo scene, the bar/main street scene, the house fire and the homecoming parade were all filmed in Bayfield, Colorado)
    • Production companies
      • Sagaponack Films
      • Twentieth Century Fox
    • See more company credits at IMDbPro

    Box office

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    • Gross US & Canada
      • $559,088
    See detailed box office info on IMDbPro

    Tech specs

    Edit
    • Runtime
      • 1h 47m(107 min)
    • Color
      • Color
    • Aspect ratio
      • 1.85 : 1

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