Review: 21351 Disney Tim Burton's The Nightmare Before Christmas
Posted by CapnRex101,LEGO has already developed a few minifigures and a BrickHeadz set based on The Nightmare Before Christmas, but the renowned animated film provides potential for more. 21351 Disney Tim Burton's The Nightmare Before Christmas should fulfil that potential!
The model includes various locations from the movie and certainly captures the distinctive aesthetic of Halloween Town, including plenty of crooked architecture and many accurate details. Furthermore, the character selection seems pretty impressive, although not every character translates smoothly to minifigure form.
Summary
21351 Disney Tim Burton's The Nightmare Before Christmas, 2,193 pieces.
£169.99 / $199.99 / €199.99 | 7.8p/9.1c/9.1c per piece.
Buy at LEGO.com »
Despite a few compromises, this set successfully recreates the animation's iconic style
- Attractive layout for display
- Brilliant architectural detail
- Spiral Hill looks magnificent
- Satisfying variety of characters, overall
- Limited space inside buildings
- Some major characters are missing
The set was provided for review by LEGO. All opinions expressed are those of the author.
Minifigures
Jack Skellington appeared in the second series of Disney Collectable Minifigures a few years ago and his original minifigure was excellent. However, longer legs and arms have since returned and these elements are ideal for Jack, given his extremely tall and slender build. In general, I prefer traditional minifigures and I still love the design from 2019, but this version's proportions better reflect the onscreen character.
Notably, the distinctive bow tie introduced with the previous figure returns and looks superb, as does the fabric piece around Jack's waist. The head is effective too, but should perhaps have included bigger eyes, like the Collectable Minifigure. However, this minifigure lacks decorated arms and the pinstripes on his legs look awkward because they finish so abruptly, presumably for manufacturing reasons.
Like her beau, Sally also appeared in 71024 Disney Collectable Minifigures Series 2. Sadly, this version of the character does not match the standard of its predecessor. The intricate stitching and mismatched patterns look pretty good, but the earlier minifigure fared even better and benefited from dual-moulded legs, which this one lacks.
The aqua printing on the legs is particularly disappointing, as it comes nowhere near matching the skin tone of the arms and head. Also, the unique hair element created for the Collectable Minifigure has been replaced with a more common piece, often used for Albus Dumbledore, among others. This hairstyle looks reasonable, but pales in comparison to the existing design, which can be said for the whole figure.
Neither minifigure includes any accessories, but Sally's head is double-sided and features two expressions similar to her last appearance. I would have preferred a sad or concerned face on one side and perhaps an alternative head could have been provided for Jack as well, reflecting his ennui for much of the film.
Jack's faithful dog, Zero, is also included and represented by a single dual-moulded piece. This element is brilliantly detailed, even featuring the tiny pumpkin that forms Zero's glowing nose, but it does not really resemble a standard LEGO piece because the only connection point is hidden underneath. I am unsure where any studs or clips could be added though, so maybe this is the best solution.
Brick-built figures are an option, but probably not for a character of Zero's size. That route has been taken for the Mayor of Halloween Town, however, whose conical shape in the film is perfectly duplicated here. The printed torso and head both look marvellous and the head is reversible, as seen onscreen, with delighted and nervous expressions.
Additionally, I like the outlandish proportions of the mayor's hat and his stubby legs. The only problem is the figure's overall size, as he should be among the shorter residents of Halloween Town, but is instead even taller than Jack. While scaling between characters does not bother me too much, perhaps this was an opportunity to develop a shorter 2x2 cone for the head.
LEGO has produced plenty of Santa Claus minifigures, but this one is unique. Based on his proportions in The Nightmare Before Christmas, a brick-built figure like the mayor could have worked for Santa, although I am satisfied with a more conventional minifigure. The printed dress element is particularly welcome, as it could find use for other versions of Santa Claus.
The details on the torso are fun too, such as a lollipop tucked into his belt and some triangular sweets beneath his beard. The beard itself could be improved though, since it should be much bigger. That would need a new piece, although increasing the variety of available LEGO beards would be no bad thing.
Santa carries a large candy cane, which debuted with the Sugar Fairy Collectable Minifigure a few years ago and looks superb. The mayor also comes with some accessories, including his megaphone for making announcements and plans for next Halloween, rolled up and awaiting Jack Skellington's urgent approval.
The final three characters are arguably surprising inclusions, as Lock, Shock and Barrel are less prominent than other potential options, like Dr. Finkelstein or Oogie Boogie. Also, their onscreen costumes are relatively plain and therefore difficult to translate to minifigure form, especially in Lock's case, as his devilish attire is completely red. His tail is missing too, even though an ideal piece already exists.
Shock looks better, thanks to her witch's hat and medium lavender skirt, complementing the lavender torso in between. The shape of the hat and dark bluish grey hair is far from perfect though, as both should be thinner. Maybe this was another chance to develop a new element, but I would not expect one for such a relatively minor character.
Barrel is my favourite of the trio, as his rudimentary skeleton costume is recognisable from the film and his green hair stands out, also corresponding with the original character. In addition, I like the trick-or-treaters' double-sided heads, each featuring strange expressions. Once again, short of introducing new parts, this was the best solution to represent their masks.
The Completed Model
Lock, Shock and Barrel are dispatched to kidnap Sandy Claws, as the residents of Halloween Town know him. They travel aboard a walking bathtub, which looks pretty good in LEGO form. There is ample room for Santa to lie down in the bathtub following his capture, or for the three children to stand inside on their way to Christmas Town.
Condensing the whole of Halloween Town into a manageable model was sure to involve some tricky decisions, as not all locations could realistically be included. I think the fan designer, Simon Scott, made an excellent choice in focusing on the town hall, Jack's house and the famous Spiral Hill, so I am pleased LEGO has retained that layout, albeit reducing the size of each structure, relative to the original submission.
Although fairly small, the town hall's distinctive shape is recreated faithfully, widening towards the top. Additionally, I like the uneven shape of the base, as its edges trail off and suggest the texture continues. There is still enough space for a tree, a cobbled path and a fountain though, each featuring ample detail and contrasting with the predominantly grey building behind them.
The fountain is a central location in the film, where Jack is introduced and the townsfolk often gather. The mysterious green liquid inside looks great, combining trans-bright green and lime green elements, while the statue looming over the slime matches the source material closely. The tiny wings are particularly fun, but there should be slime spewing from the statue's mouth.
Even the irregular shape of the fountain is accurate to The Nightmare Before Christmas and I appreciate the space for characters beside the fountain. The cobblestones look lovely as well, matching paths elsewhere in the town and passing the first of many skulls found in this set, en route to the town hall.
Pumpkins are another common feature, appearing in dark orange for only the fourth time and adding splashes of colour to the model. The long-dead tree beside the town hall looks superb too, featuring gnarled branches, which are individually adjustable to position the tree however you choose.
Many of the buildings in Halloween Town widen dramatically from the base to the roof and the town hall is no exception. I love how the decorative columns follow this shape and the carved stonework at the foot of the columns matches the structure onscreen. The off-kilter entrance looks marvellous too, on the whole, although the medium nougat doors seem rather bland.
The black and orange Halloween banner is faultless though, correctly attached using a bone. Similarly, the stickered Christmas countdown above the black and orange banner looks great, although this is positioned slightly higher in the film. Fortunately, the spider web clock matches the source material exactly, displaying the time of year, rather than the time of day.
The roof panels make brilliant use of 1x1 and 1x2 slopes, slotting together neatly to create the desired shape and leaving minimal gaps between them. The dark bluish grey bands along the edges of the roof seem attractive and alternating 2x2 and 2x3 tiles form a simple, but effective, pattern across the top.
Several of the buildings in The Nightmare Before Christmas are much bigger inside than they appear from outside. That is absolutely fine in the medium of animation, but not so for LEGO, hence the town hall's interior is quite compact. Nonetheless, I like the dark bluish grey plates resembling curtains on the back, flanking Jack's podium, from where he hosts town meetings.
The podium is easily removable to reveal a couple of benches inside. Space is obviously very limited, but you can still place a few characters inside. Furthermore, various accurate details from the onscreen location are replicated here, such as the stickered masks and snake-like candleholders mounted on the walls.
In addition, you can remove the town hall from its base to uncover even more details. Beyond the requisite skeleton, which seems to be brewing a potion in its cauldron, this area contains a pitchfork, a wreath, a spider and a dark green jar hidden in the corner. Maybe this is intended to represent a jar of Frog's Breath, which is a vital ingredient in Sally's soup for Dr. Finkelstein.
The roof panels are also removable, concealing another spider, a brick-built wreath and more festive accessories. These items could be used in Jack's presentation about Christmas to the townsfolk, or to decorate Halloween Town for Christmas, as suggested on the back of the box. Either way, I am glad the available space is being used.
Jack's podium is an ideal size for such a tall minifigure and its jagged shape corresponds with the movie. However, this podium is supposed to be made of wood, so dark brown might have been a better colour choice than grey and black, partly because brown would stand out more clearly when placed inside the town hall.
As the prestigious Pumpkin King, Jack Skellington resides in a prime position overlooking the town. The house stands atop an impossibly slender outcrop onscreen, so its proportions have required dramatic adaptation to LEGO form. For complete accuracy, the staircase to reach this building would be much longer and visible behind the gates, but this model prioritises stability.
Medium nougat and dark tan round tiles again form cobbles outside Jack's house, leading to a pair of imposing gates. Remarkably, this gate element has only appeared once before in pearl dark grey and that was over a decade ago, in 7187 Escape from the Dragon's Prison, so I am delighted to see it available again.
The curved walls beside the entrance look outstanding, as various bricks, plates and tiles are combined to create stunning texture. The medium nougat accents are very effective and I like how the hinge plates are integrated, almost disappearing into the rough brickwork. Additionally, the foliage around the walls looks good, notably including some reddish orange flowers.
Although the staircase outside Jack's home has been reduced in size, the designer has made clever use of 2x2 plates with two studs and 1x2 plates with slides to maximise the number of steps. Their irregular structure looks perfect and dark tan is a good colour choice to contrast with the house. Moreover, the brick-built statues flanking the gates look remarkably accurate.
You cannot easily place a minifigure on the steps and there is certainly no room for the mayor, who visits Jack's home in the film. However, I think that was a worthy compromise to increase the number of steps. Furthermore, the detail around the staircase is attractive, including some orange leaves scattered at the base of the tree, plus another dark orange pumpkin.
Despite lacking the enormous hill underneath, Jack's house still measures an impressive 33cm in height. Its proportions also look reasonable, as this is another building that becomes broader towards the top. Admittedly, its shape is much more complex onscreen, narrowing basically to a point at the base, but like the rocky outcrop, recreating such an unstable structure would be near-impossible.
The door includes a stickered eyeball for the peephole, but the screaming doorbell is missing, unfortunately. The black pillars supporting the porch are splendid though, resembling wrought iron. The texture on the roof is surprisingly appealing too, only relying on a few 1x2 slopes and some exposed studs.
Three more supports are located on the level above, with a trans-yellow window in the middle. Again, the design is greatly simplified in relation to the source material, although the essential features are all included and I like the dark bluish grey tiles on the uppermost floor, which look suitably ramshackle. Another yellow-tinted window is found here, as though illuminated.
I have already mentioned the inconsistent sizes between the interiors and exteriors of various buildings in Halloween Town and nowhere is that more true than the tower atop Jack's house. Though it seems more like a chimney, this tower should actually contain a spacious lab, with panoramic windows. Ideally, the 4x4 hollow cone integrated here would be printed with those windows.
Once again, the interior is rather cramped, particularly on the ground floor, where there is only enough room for a Christmas tree. Even so, I like the tree's spindly design, comprising a stack of green stems and matching those displayed around Halloween Town during the film. A medium nougat sack is hidden behind the tree, ready for Jack to distribute gifts.
The room above is more detailed, with space for Jack to stand inside. The colourful books and pieces of wrapping paper on the floor look nice, while a magnifying glass and a cookie to study are placed on the desk. Most important of all, however, is the sketch of Jack Skellington dressed as Santa. The image does not show a hat in the film, but this sticker is still a welcome addition.
Another sticker forms a blackboard, recording Jack's bizarre attempts to understand Christmas. The chalk attached to the board looks good and the sticker includes a couple of references to the fan designer, showing his initials and birthday among the different formulae. A pearl silver fish and a trans-green bottle are stored underneath.
Several more accessories are kept in the attic space, which is accessed by removing the roof panels. These items include another skull, a pumpkin and two more wreaths, plus some small presents. Fun though these accessories are, a little more variety would have been appreciated. Four identical wreaths are included, after all, which seems excessive.
Of the various interesting locations featured in The Nightmare Before Christmas, I think Spiral Hill is the most iconic. As well as appearing on the movie poster, this is where Jack expresses his frustrations about Halloween and where he finally realises his love for Sally. The distinctive spiral shape looks superb and its uniformly black colour is striking, silhouetted against the moon.
Spiral Hill is situated in a graveyard and this part of the model is surprisingly colourful, despite the macabre subject. Sand blue tiles and jumper plates provide a striking contrast beneath the gravestones, alongside several more cobblestones and pumpkins. I like the carved pumpkins in particular, originally developed for the Scooby-Doo theme.
Each gravestone takes inspiration from one shown in the film. For instance, Sally hides behind the scratched marker on the left when Jack sings about the repetitive nature of Halloween. Zero's dog house is included too, with a stud for the figure outside, while scattered lavender flowers denote the deadly nightshade Sally collects to send her creator, Dr. Finkelstein, to sleep.
The spiral-shaped feature that gives Spiral Hill its name is quite basic, but the curvature of the surrounding land looks lovely and the spiral itself matches the onscreen location as closely as possible, considering its size. Furthermore, the pale yellow moon behind the hill is spectacular, represented by a sturdy plasticard sheet. The same material was already used for the photos in 21345 Polaroid OneStep SX-70 Camera.
Assembling the moon from bright light yellow bricks would certainly be possible, but that would also require a considerable number of parts and bright light yellow has notorious problems with colour matching. On that basis, this was a sensible solution. There is just enough room to stand Jack and Sally on top of Spiral Hill, recreating the film's famous final scene.
The moon is discretely attached using a 2L bar with ball joint and the copyright information on the card is completely hidden from the front, thankfully. Additionally, a few more details can be found beneath the hill, including a spider, a skull and the last of the eight dark orange pumpkins provided, plus some dark green vines.
Overall
21351 Disney Tim Burton's The Nightmare Before Christmas is an appealing set, managing to include most of the essential characters and locations from the classic stop-motion film. The architecture of Halloween Town is captured beautifully and I think the designer has struck a reasonable balance between accuracy and stability, even though certain compromises were needed for Jack's house.
Similarly, the minifigure selection is good, but not faultless. I could probably have done without the trick-or-treaters because those characters are poorly suited to minifigure form, while Sally's earlier figure was better than this one. Nevertheless, this set serves as an enjoyable celebration of The Nightmare Before Christmas, even though the price of £169.99, $199.99 or €199.99 is a little too expensive for its size.
131 likes
64 comments on this article
I have to say that I think the finished product is disappointing having read this review. The quality of the Sally minifigure is unacceptable in a Lego set of this size and price point, the mayor is rather crude (why couldn’t the hands be colour matched better?) and the buildings are small to the point of virtual un-usability for any kind of play.
I get this is designed more as a display model, but I’m not convinced it does that particularly well. I appreciate the effort, but the end result is below what I’d expect from LEGO in 2024.
Apathy towards the source material aside, this just has way too many faults, inaccuracies, and missed opportunities to even remotely hook me. Easy, easy, EASY pass.
It's weird that they didn't just reuse the previous Sally minifig, like they did with Aurora. Maybe there's something tricky going on in the license agreement.
@Andrusi said:
"It's weird that they didn't just reuse the previous Sally minifig, like they did with Aurora. Maybe there's something tricky going on in the license agreement."
Or maybe they don’t make that hair piece any more? Though that doesn’t explain the rest of the figure’s low quality…
is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture
I think this set looks really good, and found the review unwarrantedly peevish. The only minifigure complaint I can agree with is the lack of the devil's tail, since that's an excisting piece, but it's probably out of production, and I think Lock, Shock and Barrel were a very natural selection of figs for the set, since they are important to the plot and didn't require any new moulds, unlike Doctor Finkelstein. You can fill up the rest of the set with the vast amount of Halloween themed characters LEGO have produced over the years.
@Ephseb said:
"is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture"
This IP has been a massive money-maker for Disney - merchandise sales for this have steadily climbed for years since it's debut, mainly starting within the goth community all over the world, but now it's much more widely popular. Concerts, re-releases of the film, 3D conversions, video games, theme parks and much more merchandise have followed in recent years, all over the world. It's a juggernaut for Disney.
Unpopular opinion:
I think Jack would be better served by a minidoll.
Cheaping out on dual molded legs for Sally in a $200 product when it was done for $5? Knowing this, Zero is the only perfect character here. Huge miss on the minifig front. I've been so on the fence about if I want this, and I dunno know, but that is the little nudge I needed to opt out.
@Ephseb said:
"is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture"
It’s *enormous*. Every year new merchandise is rolled out for both Halloween and Christmas, from lights and ornaments and plush toys to snow globes and napkins and themed candies and foods. NBC is easily one of the most prominent and easily-marketed-ad-nauseum properties Disney owns - far beyond even the likes of Frozen. Indeed, when it comes to those two times of year, NBC is arguably even more prominent in their merchandising strategies than Marvel or Star Wars.
At first I thought the trick-or-treater minifigs were sorta cute (barring those evil grins on the boys) if a bit strange with the sheer lack of printing, but then I looked up an image of them in the source material and yeah, they're way too Burtony in proportions to work accurately as kid figs. That leaves us with Jack, Sally, Santa, a specialized mold Zero, and a brick-built Mayor with a stretched head. Even as someone not a fan of the source material, the minifigs do feel like a bit of a miss. If this wasn't an Ideas set, I could definitely see them splitting this into three separate sets (maybe add a fourth other location) with more minifigs spread throughout them to turn it into a single-wave theme - while a theme for a non-recent movie would be a bit strange, I think that Lego probably could have made more money and satisfied more customers in the long run if they took advantage of its annual popularity to make multiple smaller sets that provide more variation in minifigures. Heck, if they wanted to keep the $200 set, they could pull a 2000s and have a retailer-exclusive bundle of the three separate sets with an exclusive Santa Jack minifigure or something.
Passing, I'm not a Burton fan and I have other sets to put my money towards, but I can see why others would buy this with little hesitation.
Jack's stripes cut off in a way to form the silhouette of boots, so I don't see an issue there. However, Lock not even having his devil tail is inexcusable. (The figures don't depict their masks at all, though. Both faces depict them unmasked; the masks for Lock and Shock are opaque colors different from their skintones.)
I also find the Mayor ever more frustrating. Having a four-stud connection that forces you to completely disconnect and flip his head doesn't feel right since it spins on the character, and the scale is frustrating. A Minion-style figure with a conical body and head would be perfect, and were this not an Ideas set, we might have gotten that and the right pieces for Lock and Sally.
Overall, Jack, Shock, and Barrel are the only figures that feel worth owning in this set, and really only Jack and Barrel feel fully sufficient among them. I might just get Skellington on his own.
I like it, but I wish there was a small tribute set to TNBC with just the moon section and Jack and Sally. The buildings are not a must have as a display reference set for that movie.
Based on the way the bottom of the pinstripes on the back of the torso form a curve (where they have _no_ problem printing to the edge), I'd guess the curvature on the bottom of the legs is a stylistic choice vs ending them abruptly above the feet, but it looks _so weird_, like he's wearing black chaps or something. Or, I suppose, like he's being framed with a circular spotlight, and only the portion of the pinstripe that's within the light shows up well.
I used the same trick at the peak of my Home Alone garage as they used on the town hall, but none of the complexity at the bottom edge. I also went for a completely tiled surface, so I used the up brackets, which results in a slight bump at the peak (it looks somewhat like a ridge vent used on asphalt shingle roofs).
@Andrusi said:
"It's weird that they didn't just reuse the previous Sally minifig, like they did with Aurora. Maybe there's something tricky going on in the license agreement."
It was mentioned in relation to Steamboat Willie that non-CMF themes are no longer allowed to use straight copies of CMFs, as had been done with a few from S1-10. The mold for Sally's hair would be five years old right now, and we've been told it would have cost as much to maintain the original mold over that span of time as it would to just cut a new one for this set. However, that hair mold has appeared again in 2021, 2022, and 2024, so I have to assume it's due to the "no copies" rule, since neither is available in dark-red outside of the two Sally minifigs.
Dual-molded legs in an Ideas set would be a burden on their limited new element budget, so they're infrequently used. Notably, 21108 would have been a great use, but skipped them in favor of more critical recolors. 21316 used them in four colors, but was perhaps the most necessary use seen in Ideas. 21320 is perhaps the biggest bang for the buck, as those dual-molded legs have appeared now in _four_ Ideas sets. And the most extravagent use may be 21310, which used two that are still exclusive to that set.
@Ephseb said:
"is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture"
Americard revoked!
@Mister_Jonny said:
" @Andrusi said:
"It's weird that they didn't just reuse the previous Sally minifig, like they did with Aurora. Maybe there's something tricky going on in the license agreement."
Or maybe they don’t make that hair piece any more? Though that doesn’t explain the rest of the figure’s low quality…
"
Sally’s old hair piece showed up in 42615 Pet Adoption Day, released this year.
@Studnotontop said:
" @Mister_Jonny said:
" @Andrusi said:
"It's weird that they didn't just reuse the previous Sally minifig, like they did with Aurora. Maybe there's something tricky going on in the license agreement."
Or maybe they don’t make that hair piece any more? Though that doesn’t explain the rest of the figure’s low quality…
"
Sally’s old hair piece showed up in 42615 Pet Adoption Day, released this year.
"
Well that makes its absence here even more perplexing.
@PurpleDave said:
"Based on the way the bottom of the pinstripes on the back of the torso form a curve (where they have _no_ problem printing to the edge), I'd guess the curvature on the bottom of the legs is a stylistic choice vs ending them abruptly above the feet, but it looks _so weird_, like he's wearing black chaps or something. Or, I suppose, like he's being framed with a circular spotlight, and only the portion of the pinstripe that's within the light shows up well.
I used the same trick at the peak of my Home Alone garage as they used on the town hall, but none of the complexity at the bottom edge. I also went for a completely tiled surface, so I used the up brackets, which results in a slight bump at the peak (it looks somewhat like a ridge vent used on asphalt shingle roofs).
@Andrusi said:
"It's weird that they didn't just reuse the previous Sally minifig, like they did with Aurora. Maybe there's something tricky going on in the license agreement."
It was mentioned in relation to Steamboat Willie that non-CMF themes are no longer allowed to use straight copies of CMFs, as had been done with a few from S1-10. The mold for Sally's hair would be five years old right now, and we've been told it would have cost as much to maintain the original mold over that span of time as it would to just cut a new one for this set. However, that hair mold has appeared again in 2021, 2022, and 2024, so I have to assume it's due to the "no copies" rule, since neither is available in dark-red outside of the two Sally minifigs.
Dual-molded legs in an Ideas set would be a burden on their limited new element budget, so they're infrequently used. Notably, 21108 would have been a great use, but skipped them in favor of more critical recolors. 21316 used them in four colors, but was perhaps the most necessary use seen in Ideas. 21320 is perhaps the biggest bang for the buck, as those dual-molded legs have appeared now in _four_ Ideas sets. And the most extravagent use may be 21310, which used two that are still exclusive to that set.
@Ephseb said:
"is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture"
Americard revoked!
"
Even if they couldn't copy the CMF for the set, the print of new Sally is still different enough that LEGO could surely use the same hair mold...especially since they still have it in use recently and it's screen-accurate!
I never watched the nightmare before Christmas movie when I was younger. This set though has made me want watch it now.
The original Ideas set is MUCH better than this.
@8BrickMario:
I don't know how restrictive the "no copying CMFs" rule is. I only know that this is the reason stated for why the 21317 minifigs had silver deco. The last time I can recall seeing a straight copy of a minifig was 8833-10, which appeared in 60024, 10245, 60099, 40125, and 60133 before they finally debuted a new Santa torso print in 60155. But yeah, realizing that the hair that was produced specifically for Sally is still in use in a 2024 set was a shock.
Was not aware of the no copy rule; thx, answered a question I’ve been curious of on several occasions. I am envious of TLG’s depth of accounting, extraordinary. Also another great review, your lightly sarcastic style has an enjoyable flow, thx agn.
They didn’t even include the trick or treaters masks - which are iconic.
There’s barely anything here, it might be 2000 pieces but it doesn’t look it, love this movie but I have no desire to purchase this set.
@PurpleDave said:
"
@Ephseb said:
"is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture"
Americard revoked!
"
:(
@Ephseb said:
"is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture"
I've never seen any reference to this movie outside the US. But definitely well known within
Still thinking that only spiral hill part of the set would have been enough.
@PurpleDave, regarding the no copying CMFs rule: I'm not seeing a huge amount of difference between https://brickset.com/minifigs/sh0939/wolverine-yellow-and-black-mask-blue-hands and 71039-12. All I see is that the latter has printed arms.
@Zackula said:
" @Ephseb said:
"is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture"
I've never seen any reference to this movie outside the US. But definitely well known within"
Every year in Australia they have Nightmare Before Christmas merchandise in the stores around Halloween. But if you don't look at Halloween merchandise you may not notice it around.
I see clothing all year round on randoms out and about.
Likely I only notice it because I am a fan though. If you are not a fan it wouldn't stand out anymore than any other smaller license. Certainly not on the same level as the Star Wars, Marvel, Disney Princess merchandising, but certainly around.
This set doesn't really entice me to buy it, but it has given me an itch to rewatch the film. I haven't seen it in a good 7 or 8 years, but a few of the songs are still chiming around in my head. If this ever goes on sale for like $150 I might be tempted to buy, but otherwise I'll just keep an eye on the secondhand market for that Jack and Zero.
@Ephseb said:
"is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture"
Maybe it's not anymore, but for the 2000-mid 2010's at least it was essentially *the* goth movie. Any kid who was into bats and ghouls had a Jack Skellington mug or key chain, and you couldn't go into Hot Topic without half the store featuring the guy. Funny enough I was with my mom helping her pajama shop at Walmart and they had an entire rack dedicated to him and Sally, even though Halloween is still a ways away. I'd say it's more popular with teens than kids or adults (and most of those teens grow out of it) but that's enough to have kept it relevant and a real merch cash cow.
@Zackula said:
" @Ephseb said:
"is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture"
I've never seen any reference to this movie outside the US. But definitely well known within"
The fact that Halloween isn’t that big outside of the US almost certainly killed the international box office.
@TheOtherMike:
Different torso assembly (but same torso), different head, and…ooh, so sneaky! Both have blue hips. One has blue legs with yellow print, while the other has yellow legs with blue print.
@PurpleDave said:
" @Zackula said:
" @Ephseb said:
"is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture"
I've never seen any reference to this movie outside the US. But definitely well known within"
The fact that Halloween isn’t that big outside of the US almost certainly killed the international box office. "
Halloween has become more popular over here in Germany in recent years, but I've yet to see NBC merchandise in stores. I guess the movie wasn't popular at the time here either. At least I know no one who went to see it back then, and I definitely know we didn't talk about it among friends. And that's saying something because at that time I was a total movie buff who went to the cinema at least twice a week. Nowadays, not so much. Just don't care for the umpteenth prequel, sequel or remake / reboot of whatever franchise the movie studios pull out of the closet.
@Kalking: over here NBC is one of the least well known Disney properties. Frozen on the other hand is still huge, even years after it's release. You can get all kinds of merchandise everywhere. Same with even older stuff like the ever popular Lion King.
Hell, I'd go so far as to say that even movies like the Jungle Book, Cinderella, or even Lilo & Stitch have a far higher amount of merchandise (and public awareness) than NBC over here.
NBC has always be around overhere in the Netherlands. I don’t know how good the movie was doing here, but since its existence we’ve had merch galore. At first mostly at goth, geeky or comic stores, later on also in the big franchises that wanted to ride along the renewed it’s ok to be a nerd/fanboy(girl) fashion.
I was never a big fan to be honest, but i do like the set. Especially the builds and their lay-out. The minifigs don’t really work for me, but the shaping of the houses is really well-done. I expect this to be a set that will be rebuild every year.
i have never seen and will never watch the movie because there is just zero interest in anything from disney. the only movie which sparks my childhood memories is, in my opinion the most underrated or even forgotten disney movie ever - The sword in the stone.. and i do not understand why there is no remake or even merchandise about that movie..
Anyways another unpopular opinion of mine is that Halloween doesnt belong here at all. Its part of the american coulture, why are we starting to celebrate it in germany in recent years? i dont get it. i mean why are we not celebrating anything then? how about the indian holi festival? Thats massively popular as well. lets introduce that in germany! that makes sense then, doesnt it.
This set and the minifigures are just plain ugly to me plus a very high pricepoint and at least in my opinion of a dumb ip. Sorry but anything disney is realy bad in my opinion and i know that is a lot nowadays.. i was never a fan of star wars either but i heard often that since it belongs to disney it went crap crack crazy.. the acolyte is so bad many people dont believe this is star wars. i dont know but i have a feeling that they are right.
Stay away from this and disney! This will open up space for nice things!
I dont need any comentary on my comment, i dont want a fight or anything i just wanted to say that there is people out there who couldnt care less about disney. Actually i am more bothered about it since its all around us everywhere and anywhere a little bit like Nestle ;)
Cheers folks
@AustinPowers:
As this cultural shift happened decades after the film released, it was too late to save the box office, and probably too late to really cement the film in mind as something to watch after Halloween. Given enough time, that may change, but it’s going to take a lot of word of mouth to build up cult status from zero.
@Oli : I completely agree about Halloween not belonging here. It feels like a forced on thing, done only for making money (which is typical for anything in American "culture" - everything is just about "make people happy by buying stuff for them").
Every year now I dread the end of October, when we have to waste money buying tons of sweets and spend the entire evening running to the door every couple of minutes just to stuff some treats into kids' bags. It's not even that they would be imaginative, like offering some verse or rhyme like some did in the early years. Some don't say anything at all, they just expect you to give them something. Plus often it's groups of teens or young adults instead of kids. These we turn away and tell them off, because they are usually the most greedy (and unthankful). I can understand that little kids have fun with it and they are the ones we happily gift with sweets, but we draw a line with the 18+ group.
I'm always extremely happy when that day has passed.
Plus, the day after is a very important church holiday, and I absolutely hate it that most people don't even know its meaning anymore, yet have no problem celebrating the god of commerce the evening before.
That's also why I would never buy this set. I would never want to have anything to do with Halloween in my house.
@PurpleDave : like I alluded to above, the problem with Halloween over here is that - contrary to Christmas in particular - it has never been part of our culture, and especially to older people feels forced upon us by massive marketing only. There's no natural evolution, it's just like Valentine's day, another US thing that has been forced on us, in that case a couple of years earlier than Halloween, but still forced by marketing pressure.
When I was a kid there was no Halloween celebration over here, neither was Valentine's day. And back then there would at least have been a natural reason for both, since back then there used to be US military garrisons in every major city in our part of Germany, and there was a lot more American influence originating from those. All the McDonald's venues we had back then for example were in towns with US garrisons.
I wonder how long it will be before someone in marketing decides Germany should start celebrating Thanksgiving as well. After all, that's another chance for making loads of money, isn't it?
@Oli:
Oddly enough, as I understand it, we got Halloween from Irish immigrants, and it definitely ties into the Druidic festival of Samhain, which the Roman Catholic Church tried to absorb into their calendar. So very European in origin. But we added the pumpkins.
@AustinPowers said:
" @Oli : I completely agree about Halloween not belonging here. It feels like a forced on thing, done only for making money (which is typical for anything in American "culture" - everything is just about "make people happy by buying stuff for them").
Every year now I dread the end of October, when we have to waste money buying tons of sweets and spend the entire evening running to the door every couple of minutes just to stuff some treats into kids' bags. It's not even that they would be imaginative, like offering some verse or rhyme like some did in the early years. Some don't say anything at all, they just expect you to give them something. Plus often it's groups of teens or young adults instead of kids. These we turn away and tell them off, because they are usually the most greedy (and unthankful). I can understand that little kids have fun with it and they are the ones we happily gift with sweets, but we draw a line with the 18+ group.
I'm always extremely happy when that day has passed.
Plus, the day after is a very important church holiday, and I absolutely hate it that most people don't even know its meaning anymore, yet have no problem celebrating the god of commerce the evening before.
That's also why I would never buy this set. I would never want to have anything to do with Halloween in my house.
@PurpleDave : like I alluded to above, the problem with Halloween over here is that - contrary to Christmas in particular - it has never been part of our culture, and especially to older people feels forced upon us by massive marketing only. There's no natural evolution, it's just like Valentine's day, another US thing that has been forced on us, in that case a couple of years earlier than Halloween, but still forced by marketing pressure.
When I was a kid there was no Halloween celebration over here, neither was Valentine's day. And back then there would at least have been a natural reason for both, since back then there used to be US military garrisons in every major city in our part of Germany, and there was a lot more American influence originating from those. All the McDonald's venues we had back then for example were in towns with US garrisons.
I wonder how long it will be before someone in marketing decides Germany should start celebrating Thanksgiving as well. After all, that's another chance for making loads of money, isn't it? "
It definitly feels forced to me as well. A money machine to keep producing stuff you only need for a very short amount of time preparing month in advance!
Plus we have carnival as well which in fact belongs here and is celebrated similar to Halloween in temrs of waering costumes and ringing other peoples bells to recieve sweets after singing some carnival related songs to the dooropener.
For me Halloween is too far off our culture.We send away the bad by celebrating new years or am i wrong? Why else we need to buy every year on firecrackers and rockets which are realy realy bad to our invironment? Well, thats just like disney in my opinion. A moneymachine (franchise) for the dumb and narrow sighted. The Acolyte is a very good example.
I simply love this film. The Sally minifig doesn't work at all - her song while slowly walking up Spiral Hill was one of the most beautiful pieces of animation I'd seen, and the minifig is so far from that. And they missed a trick - Spiral Hill should unwind. That would have been a wonderful feature.
I’ve spent the past year or so looking forward to this set, hadn’t bought much this year so I would be able to afford it and then this comes out. Feels like such a big disappointment compared to the original model
@8BrickMario said:
"Jack's stripes cut off in a way to form the silhouette of boots, so I don't see an issue there. However, Lock not even having his devil tail is inexcusable. (The figures don't depict their masks at all, though. Both faces depict them unmasked; the masks for Lock and Shock are opaque colors different from their skintones.)"
Jack does not wear long boots, so I am pretty sure the decoration being cut off relates to manufacturing rather than a deliberate decision only to cover part of the legs.
@TheOtherMike said:
" @PurpleDave , regarding the no copying CMFs rule: I'm not seeing a huge amount of difference between https://brickset.com/minifigs/sh0939/wolverine-yellow-and-black-mask-blue-hands and 71039-12 . All I see is that the latter has printed arms."
As well as the things @PurpleDave has mentioned, the Collectable Minifigure also has dual-moulded legs with printing around the sides, whereas the later version only has printed legs. The difference is much more apparent on the physical minifigures than in renders.
There is a Netflix documentary series called "The Movies that Made Us", and season 3 has an episode for The Nightmare Before Christmas. I recommend for those who have already watched the movie and want to know more about the production and the cult following the movie has gained years after its release.
@PurpleDave said:
"Based on the way the bottom of the pinstripes on the back of the torso form a curve (where they have _no_ problem printing to the edge), I'd guess the curvature on the bottom of the legs is a stylistic choice vs ending them abruptly above the feet, but it looks _so weird_, like he's wearing black chaps or something. Or, I suppose, like he's being framed with a circular spotlight, and only the portion of the pinstripe that's within the light shows up well.
I used the same trick at the peak of my Home Alone garage as they used on the town hall, but none of the complexity at the bottom edge. I also went for a completely tiled surface, so I used the up brackets, which results in a slight bump at the peak (it looks somewhat like a ridge vent used on asphalt shingle roofs).
@Andrusi said:
"It's weird that they didn't just reuse the previous Sally minifig, like they did with Aurora. Maybe there's something tricky going on in the license agreement."
It was mentioned in relation to Steamboat Willie that non-CMF themes are no longer allowed to use straight copies of CMFs, as had been done with a few from S1-10. The mold for Sally's hair would be five years old right now, and we've been told it would have cost as much to maintain the original mold over that span of time as it would to just cut a new one for this set. However, that hair mold has appeared again in 2021, 2022, and 2024, so I have to assume it's due to the "no copies" rule, since neither is available in dark-red outside of the two Sally minifigs.
Dual-molded legs in an Ideas set would be a burden on their limited new element budget, so they're infrequently used. Notably, 21108 would have been a great use, but skipped them in favor of more critical recolors. 21316 used them in four colors, but was perhaps the most necessary use seen in Ideas. 21320 is perhaps the biggest bang for the buck, as those dual-molded legs have appeared now in _four_ Ideas sets. And the most extravagent use may be 21310, which used two that are still exclusive to that set.
@Ephseb said:
"is this IP even a big thing outside the US? I've only heard about it in connection with Lego and I would consider myself reasonably well-versed in American pop culture"
Americard revoked!
"
At the end of the day, these restrictions stem from LEGO’s policies, and if those policies are affecting products in a negative manner, especially expensive collector’s items, then it is the policies which should be made flexible, not designer’s adherence to them. I don’t think that they can be treated as some sort of external force when critiquing LEGO design, they come from LEGO in the first place.
I just learned the Haunted Mansion in Disneyland gets rethemed to be NBC-related every year, and has been since 2001.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haunted_Mansion_Holiday
I don't get the complaints about Sally. Figures with molded boots and especially with side and front printing are extremely rare, I don't remember a single recent occurrence aside from Monkie Kid sets which are very different due to the chinese market.
Sallys legs with only front print aren't perfect but with the CMF going for 4-8$, basically the old Retail price, you might as well just get the extra figures of Sally and Skellington to round out the display and have the full Nightmare before Christmas collection.
The hair I can kinda understand because it is an exact match for the character but to do that it also looks way thinner than most Lego hair pieces. Using Dumbledore for a more traditionally looking figure is an absolutely useful variation and adds another useful hair piece in a new color which is more important than doing an old piece/color combo again even if the price is as high as Sallys old hair.
The really sad part is that there could have been more brickbuilt characters based on the film because Finkelstein and Oogie Boogie are more memorable than the kids but that may as well still happen later.
“ Well, this quickly descended into "my dumb tradition is better than your dumb tradition", which is only one step removed from "my imaginary friend is better than your imaginary friend". People go to war over that sort of thing.”
Pretty much this. It also seems to be straying away from discussion about the actual set.
@Ridgeheart said:"Well, this quickly descended into "my dumb tradition is better than your dumb tradition", which is only one step removed from "my imaginary friend is better than your imaginary friend". People go to war over that sort of thing."
And, by extension, whose imaginary friend would win in a fight.
@KingTyrannos:
The thing with rules, though, is that they're meaningless if you don't adhere to them. There was a time when other themes were free to dip into the CMF archives and borrow whole minifigs into their sets. Offhand, I know two S1 minifigs appear in 853195, the S2 Witch is in 850487, and minifigs from S2-4 fill 850449. A few complete minifigs have appeared in BAM selections, sometimes even with their accessories. But if I had to point my finger at any specific instance that cause the rule to be set in place, it would most likely be Santa Clause. Just the sheer number of times they cranked that one CMF out (3x Advent Calendars, 1x Winter Village, and 1x holiday GWP) feels like the sort of thing that would have rubbed the CMF team the wrong way. Minifigs are their only thing, so for another theme to have full access to their designs makes the originals feel less special. Doing it on an annual basis started making my eyebrow rise, so I can only imagine how it sat with the CMF team.
On the other hand, when it comes to IP themes, it has to be a bit galling for the main team to be told they're cut off from a specific minifig because the CMF team already staked it out for a $5 set. If they hadn't figured out the silver hack for Steamboat Willie, I don't think that project would have been approved (how do you make that set and not include a Mickey minifig?), and skipping Wolverine in an X-Men set would negatively impact the sales.
@PurpleDave
Regarding CMF reuses in retail sets, it does seem like they avoid it. However, there have been a couple of exceptions in recent years. The Troubadour from CMF 22 71032-3 had his torso, head, and hat reused in 10305 only leaving his legs exclusive. The main example I can think of though is Tiana 71038-5. The exact same figure reappeared in 43222.
@Ridgeheart said:
"Well, this quickly descended into "my dumb tradition is better than your dumb tradition", which is only one step removed from "my imaginary friend is better than your imaginary friend". People go to war over that sort of thing.
I like Halloween. I like ghosts and ghouls and spooky things, I like the kitsch-value of it all. I am a big fan of pulp-horror. And I like stories, even the ones about other peoples' imaginary friends. I can take or leave their traditions, but better yet, I can leave them to their traditions. It's your imaginary friend's imaginary birthday! Hooray, let's celebrate! Or not. But don't get your knickers in a twist just because I want to celebrate something else, or on some other date. Your imaginary friend is not the boss of me, and neither are you."
Well said. However, my imaginary friend is better than yours.....ah yup....
Seriously, very well said, we seem of a similar mind, love October for the spooky, we watch two months worth of spooky movies, including the clasics....1930-1940 universal monsters. Oh, and Nightmare Before Xmas and corpse bride
Well mine....of course....silly
Regarding the hairpiece from the CMF, it does appear in a 2024 Friends set but that set is slated to retire at the end of 2024 whereas this set is going to stay in production for longer. Its entirely possible that the mold in question isn't going to active going forward and therefore that's why they weren't allowed to use it here.
@PhantomBricks:
Ooh, good catch. I wonder why they allowed that to happen, without even the easy fix of changing the prints on the head. The only exclusive part left in the CMF ends up being the Tiana's Place tile. I kinda wonder if Disney got involved in that decision. Looking at the cast from that set, I see four matched couples. Three of the princesses are white, with Tiana being the only exception. In the Disney Princess franchise (which officially excludes the Frozen IP), there are seven white princesses and six representing other races. Two of those (Moana and Raya) don't even have prince archetypes in their films, so they're not a good fit for a set that features prince/princess pairings. Pocahontas' "prince" is white (and historically problematic, to the point that I wonder if the only reason they haven't invoked a "no real people" rule is that they don't have another Native American lined up to replace her). That basically leaves Jasmine, Mulan, and Tiana as the only three options, of which the latter would probably play the best in the US, as well as being the most obviously not-white of the trio.
I feel like Jack could have benefitted from them including a few extra minifigure heads with alternate expressions for him. I love this set and can't wait to get one, but I do feel some of the minfigs are a little bit lacking. Thankfully there are other pieces we can use to customize them (and a better Sally fig that already exists).
I hope this set sells really well and encourages LEGO to do more Nightmare Before Christmas sets. There would definitely be a huge market for it as it's an incredibly popular movie.
@PurpleDave
Indeed, I think Disney likely had a hand in it. Jasmine and Aladdin might be more popular, but they already had minifigure debuts in prior CMFs. Mulan while Asian has the same color skin tone as other white figures and may not fit Disney(or Lego's) quota. Naveen also appears to be far more popular than Shang Li(I had to look up his name even though I watched the movie). I never even watched the Princess and the Frog and I knew Naveen's name.
That being said, I don't think it spoils exclusivity of a CMF too much. Both modern sets that have CMF repeats or partials are $400+ and incredibly exclusive in their own right.
I think this set looks great. I'll probably need to get two, one for myself & one for my daughter, she is a big fan of this movie.
@PurpleDave said:
" @Oli:
Oddly enough, as I understand it, we got Halloween from Irish immigrants, and it definitely ties into the Druidic festival of Samhain, which the Roman Catholic Church tried to absorb into their calendar. So very European in origin. But we added the pumpkins."
‘It was not until after mass Irish and Scottish immigration in the 19th century that Halloween became a major holiday in America.[26] Most American Halloween traditions were inherited from the Irish and Scots.’ - Wikipedia
‘You just made an enemy for life!’ - Groundskeeper Willie
Honestly, reading this review increased my appreciation of the build, while further highlighting the shortcomings of the minifigures.
I'll definitely try to pick up Zero on BrickLink (my 6 year-old LOVES him). Maybe if I'm lucky I'll be able to find someone selling the set without the figures (I'd even settle for just the spiral hill build.
The lack of Oogie Boogie is puzzling (if they didn't want to include the minifigure, they still could have included references to the character through prints/stickers). Santa, Lock, Shock, and Barrel are all relatively minor characters in the film, so their inclusion over characters like Oogie or even more residents of Halloweentown is a bit of a bummer.
I have very little interest in this set - but I'll still 'read' the instructions to see if there isn't a few good building techniques.
My comment has to do with Lego minifig legs. Shouldn't it be the time that Lego develop a 'skinny leg' minifig part(s)(long and short)? This would be useful for: the road-runner, Gru, Jack Skellington, Marvin the martian, Dr Eggman, etc., etc...
I liked the initial photos of this set but I'm less excited about it after reading this review. The minifigures don't bother me too much although Sally is a huge downgrade from the CMF version. What really bothers me is Jack's house - I didn't realize how poorly it's been translated to brick form until I looked up a reference photo. The proportions are completely wrong! The roof is really off in particular, without any of the curvature it has in the movie, and the tower looks pretty sad. I'd pick this set up on a heavy sale but it's not worth $200, which is disappointing because Ideas usually knocks it out of the park.
Obviously it is fine in general terms but it is very expensive for the pieces that this set contains, we are in 2024, we assume that the molds and machines are already amortized, The set seems very dispersed, it is still missing the most basic, the basic and fundamental thing is the square base from the 80s that serves as a base to place all the pieces and to be able to play within well-defined limits.
Don't know much about Halloween,
don't know much about old cartoons,
don't know much about Christmas,
don't know much about creepy mayors too,
but I do know that I love you,
and I know that if I buy you too,
what a wonderful world this would be,
what a wonderful, wonderful world...
Thanks for pointing out the devils tail for Lock. I just picked one up on Bricklink. It will really add some detail to such a plain minifig.
Just like the set, an incredibly detailed review. good work! definitely a wanna have set.
An easy pass:
The price tag is absurd, the architecture looks too "clean", too "boring", too "static" and the IP is largely of zero interest to me...
I'm a big fan of TNBC and was really looking forward to this set. I'm only surprised it wasn't released years ago as it's such an iconic and well loved film. However, the set is very disappointing indeed. Lock, Shock and Barrel and the Mayor in particular look poorly thought out. The whole set is too small. This film has a major adult following but this set just looks too simple without the necessary character or detail. In comparison, the Hocus Pocus set is just fantastic. I can't believe I'm going to pass on this set but it's just not worth the price to me. I'd happily have paid more for a bigger and more detailed set and fans would certainly be expecting more considering how long it's taken for Lego to get on the TNBC train!