Adina's Reviews > Stoner

Stoner by John  Williams
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bookshelves: us, w_the-practice-of-fiction

I have very conflicting emotions regarding this novel so I decided not to rate it. For almost half of the novel I thought all the 5* reviews were right and I was listening to a literary masterpiece. Then, something happened and I started to get pissed of by the author and Stoner. I still very much enjoyed the subtle beautiful prose but I could not ignore some aspects that bothered me. I will explain in more detail what I mean but there will be spoilers. Because of that, I will start with a short spoiler free review and then get into more detail. Before everything, I state that I understand how most people read this novel and why they appreciate it and also what the intention of the author was. What follows is how I "felt" while reading, a mix of appreciating for the novel but also some indignation. Indignation might be good in some books but I am not sure this was the author's intention.

SPOILER FREE REVIEW.
William Stoner, the son of a farmer, is sent to University to study agriculture. There, he falls in love with the world of the written words and changes his major to literature. He abandons his family and their hope to improve their farm to follows his passion. Don’t worry, this is not a book about passion, it is more about the lack of it and about stoicism. He is told by his mentor that he should be professor so he decides to follow that path because he had no better plans anyway. He later marries the first girl he likes, a decision he will come to regret soon enough. The novel becomes a long succession of small bouts of restrained happiness and longer periods of extreme misery. Everyone seems to be against him and try to hurt hm. It is one of the finest examples of misery lit and stoicism again the hurts life throws at you. It was endearing and heart breaking for a while until it became too much. The stoicism became inaction/victimisation and a disappointment to me. The writing is beautiful, although detached it felt hypnotic and I had the compulsion to listen on and on. Although we are told about a series of events in the life of William Stoner I was not bored most of the time.

SOME SPOILERS FROM NOW ON
Alright, what went wrong? The magic started to dissipate after Edith came back from her father’s funeral reincarnated as Cruella, with revenge on her mind. I did not like the sudden transformation of Edith into a super villain who made every effort to make poor William’s life a living hell. She was a damaged woman from the beginning but this extra evilness/craziness felt artificial, like the author had someone in his past that he needed to take his revenge on. Stoner was the only victim, not once did the author consider Edith’s feelings and psychology. The marriage was arranged between his father and Stoner, she didn’t really have a say in the matter of her life. Her planned Holiday to Europe was cancelled and she became the wife of a stranger. It is suggested she also had some past trauma so that did not help either. Nevertheless, she was presented only as a perpetrator.

Secondly, the whole affair with the other two supper villains, the physically impaired duo, was also hard to stomach for me. I did not clearly understand the reasons behind their vendetta and their hate for the “hero”. What bothered me the most was his inaction to save his daughter, which is something I cannot forgive. I could have been lenient and take it as part of the story but the author considers Stoner a real hero, an example of resistance against the world who wants to harm him. He is the only victim, his wife and daughter are negligible. The writer does not see them as victims as well. So, yes a blame the author because I did not give this book 5 stars. The way the books started, I thought there was no way to give it less.
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Reading Progress

March 8, 2018 – Shelved
March 8, 2018 – Shelved as: to-read
October 10, 2018 – Shelved as: us
February 2, 2021 – Shelved as: w_the-practice-of-fiction
May 25, 2021 – Started Reading
May 29, 2021 –
35.0%
June 3, 2021 –
35.0% "The love Stoner has for his daughter breaks my heart. I just know this relationship will prove to be a failure and don't know if I can take it."
June 7, 2021 – Finished Reading

Comments Showing 1-50 of 66 (66 new)


Cheri So happy to see you are reading this one, Adina. One of my favourite books.


message 2: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Cheri wrote: "So happy to see you are reading this one, Adina. One of my favourite books." I like it so far. I am trying to see why it is so attractive.


Violeta Interesting approach, Adina. I don’t think the author sees Stoner as an all-powerful hero who fails to do his duty. He is rather the small hero of everyday life, same as the vast majority of people out there. You gave me food for thought, thank you!


Alvaro Francisco  Hidalgo Rodriguez Stoner is a stoic to a pathological degree. It’s not so much that he doesn’t “care”, it’s rather that he believes in leaving people alone and not interfering. He does what is right. People’s reactions to him are because he seems to be an immovable rock; they try to exert an unstoppable force. He seems not to see anybody’s humanity. The cripples in the story are used to being pitied and they react “against” the world accordingly. Stoner doesn’t care. Stoner takes the path of least resistance in everything he does and you know what happens when he finally, only partially breaks. It is unfortunate that this one time is when he is truly alive. Williams stated that Stoner was a very happy individual, but it is only by assigning happiness a negative definition, as in the absence of pain. He is a stoic hero, a character that can embody that philosophy to an almost inhuman degree. He would not have seen his life as miserable at all. Like Williams, Stoner would have said his life was “just fine”.


message 5: by Fionnuala (new) - added it

Fionnuala I don't think you 'shouldn't have' the reaction you had, Adina, books strike us all in different ways, and although the majority of readers seem to react to this book in a similar way, your reaction is very valid—and much closer to my own than most others I've read. All the things that bothered you bothered me too, so well done for calling them out.


Manan Desai Excellent review, Adina. I was introduced to Stoner and John Williams by a friend here on Goodreads. It is one of my most favourite novel. I do understand your strong emotions and issues you presented. I think Williams has succeeded with you as a reader. We aren't supposed to like every hero or hate every villain in every novel. As long as we aren't indifferent to a novel, the writer has succeeded. I also agree with the point Violet made above. Also, the novel is about Stoner as the title suggests, so it's quite natural that the writer has only concentrated on one character. Although my life isn't nearly as miserable as Stoner's, I found the story and prose to be relatable, which is rare for me.


message 7: by Baba (new)

Baba What a truly detailed and informative review... I will now have to go out and but this immediately, thank you Adina :)


Will Ansbacher Yes, spot on Adina! I too had the feeling there were several characters, not just Edith, who represented people in Williams' life that he had scores to settle with.


message 9: by Joe (new)

Joe Krakovsky Well, that was a fair review because you spoke from the heart.


message 10: by Diane (new)

Diane Wallace Honest!


message 11: by Ken (new) - rated it 5 stars

Ken Your "but, wait!" thoughts are well-taken. Of course, one could take the fact that the writer elicited these emotions so artfully as a positive, too. Excellent review. I like the "spoiler free" and "spoiler" format.


message 12: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Violeta wrote: "Interesting approach, Adina. I don’t think the author sees Stoner as an all-powerful hero who fails to do his duty. He is rather the small hero of everyday life, same as the vast majority of people..." I agree that it is how he sees it but I could not help myself being triggered by the character's inaction. We've all had moments were we should have acted but didn't but in Stoner case it is gone to extremes.


message 13: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Alvaro wrote: "Stoner is a stoic to a pathological degree. It’s not so much that he doesn’t “care”, it’s rather that he believes in leaving people alone and not interfering. He does what is right. People’s reacti..." You are right in your analysis. I am sure Stoner would say that he had a fine life. I go thorough life differently so maybe that is why I can not understand him. And that is fine, a book that brings strong reactions inside me is a good one. What I did not like is that the author felt the need to make the author suffer on all fronts. It felt like reading Dostoyevsky. He was one of my favorite authors but how those characters suffered.


message 14: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Fionnuala wrote: "I don't think you 'shouldn't have' the reaction you had, Adina, books strike us all in different ways, and although the majority of readers seem to react to this book in a similar way, your reactio..." Thank you Fionnoula. i changed that part of my review. We are one of the few that reacted this way but I can't help it. I think I liked it more than you did though.


message 15: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Manan wrote: "Excellent review, Adina. I was introduced to Stoner and John Williams by a friend here on Goodreads. It is one of my most favourite novel. I do understand your strong emotions and issues you presen..." I agree it is a positive thing. That is why I appreciate the novel, I can even say I liked it a lot. But it al also made me angry and as I said there were some artistic choices that did not sit well with me. Too much misery but i suppose that there are people to whom a lot of bad things happen.


message 16: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Baba wrote: "What a truly detailed and informative review... I will now have to go out and but this immediately, thank you Adina :)" I think you should try and read it. It is definitely an interesting and worthwhile read.


message 17: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Will wrote: "Yes, spot on Adina! I too had the feeling there were several characters, not just Edith, who represented people in Williams' life that he had scores to settle with." I know, I read your review. Some of the characters' behavior felt odd to me and this can be a valid explanation.


message 18: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Ken wrote: "Your "but, wait!" thoughts are well-taken. Of course, one could take the fact that the writer elicited these emotions so artfully as a positive, too. Excellent review. I like the "spoiler free" and..." And it is a positive thing except that I think the author wanted me to praise Stoner. Which I can't. And that is the reason i did not rate the novel. If I thought the author wanted a strong reaction from me i think I would have given it 4* at least but i think i responded a bit contrary to what was expected of me. i do not know if I make ant sense :))


message 19: by Ken (new) - rated it 5 stars

Ken Adina wrote: "Ken wrote: "Your "but, wait!" thoughts are well-taken. Of course, one could take the fact that the writer elicited these emotions so artfully as a positive, too. Excellent review. I like the "spoil..."

You make perfect sense!


message 20: by nastya (new)

nastya your review is basically reaffirms my decision to skip this one for now. I almost started it but then Ilse's and your reviews showed me there's a big chance I'll be frustrated by it at this point.


message 21: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Nastya wrote: "your review is basically reaffirms my decision to skip this one for now. I almost started it but then Ilse's and your reviews showed me there's a big chance I'll be frustrated by it at this point." I hope you will not be frustrated when you decide to give it a try.


message 22: by Rita P Smits (new) - added it

Rita P Smits On my TBR list, thank you for the spoiler-free review!


Suden Käpälä I like how you are totally candid, even with seemingly undisputed masterpieces such as this. My reasons for not rating Stoner more than 3* are slightly different, but related.
Also some of the reactions to your review were enlightening (E.g., but not limited to, Alvaro's and Manan's).
(And thanks for the reminder -- I found out that I had written a private draft note, but not published a review yet! Should still do that.)


Regina Very fair and well-articulated review!


message 25: by Neale (new) - added it

Neale Wonderful review Adina, I have had this on my tbr for so long now. I shall read your full review with spoilers after I get to it. :-)


message 26: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Rita wrote: "On my TBR list, thank you for the spoiler-free review!" Thank you, I am always doing my best to keep reviews spoiler free or to clearly signal them.


message 27: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Suden wrote: "I like how you are totally candid, even with seemingly undisputed masterpieces such as this. My reasons for not rating Stoner more than 3* are slightly different, but related.
Also some of the reac..."
I read your review and made some comments there. Glad I made you write one.


message 28: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Regina wrote: "Very fair and well-articulated review!" Thank you, Regina


message 29: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Neale wrote: "Wonderful review Adina, I have had this on my tbr for so long now. I shall read your full review with spoilers after I get to it. :-)" I am looking forward to your thoughts after you read it.


Suden Käpälä Suden wrote: "I like how you are totally candid..."
Adina wrote: "I read your review and made some comments there. Glad I made you write one."

So am I; thanks again.
Myself, I always feel that I have to justify giving low(er) ratings -- especially if I can understand why (many) others have differing opinions. Sometimes it breaks my heart to not like a masterpiece (or I even feel vaguely ashamed, haha); and I find I'm bending over backwards to explain my reasons. Afraid that others think I'm a literary barbarian, LOL! (But I shouldn't care -- and don't want to. I'll get there.)
So in that light, I respect that your being just plain honest (as well), explaining your ideas wisely and in detail; seemingly also appreciating the generic consensus, but not letting it deter you from having your own opinion. I'm glad I'm not alone in that!


Jonathan Jonsson I had such sympathy for Edith, even if the author didn't... The start of her marriage is a nightmare of repeated abuse that a woman of the time was expected to "give", while denied any positive feelings towards her body, sexuality or self-fulfilment by how she was raised.. Ultimately my sympathy for both characters melted away as they failed their daughter. The tragedy of the book, for me, is the passive acceptance of inability to change ones own trauma or to stretch out a hand to those around them... Everyone in the book is trapped in a private misery, and there is no way out, there is no courage for honesty. Stoner is no hero for me, far from it. But that is part of the tragedy for me. Someone who could have been a good man, but did not know how. Maybe I'm rambling. But you put it nicely into words - his inability to reach out to his daughter was inexcusable, and brought tears to my eyes!


message 32: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Jonathan wrote: "I had such sympathy for Edith, even if the author didn't... The start of her marriage is a nightmare of repeated abuse that a woman of the time was expected to "give", while denied any positive fee..." You said it better than I could: passive acceptance of inability to change ones own trauma or to stretch out a hand to those around them


Suden Käpälä Jonathan wrote: "some really wise stuff". (^^,)

I agree with most, if not all of what you said there, Jonathan. I read it too long ago and during a very exciting trip, so I didn't remember everything. Also, I admit I didn't do any solid research to see what the author wanted to relay.

(I often first want to find my own value in what I read; next, I care more about specific individuals' ideas and findings, than about popular opinion or that of any establishment. That said, after I've made up my own mind, I do often do some research to find out if my perceptions, that of the general populace, and the author's intentions are aligned. But I didn't really do that in this case. Hmm, I guess I'm currently doing it right here. Adina's review and the subsequent comments make me learn more about the novel!)

However, I've found myself confused at Stoner being called or described as a 'hero of stoicism'. From my personal POV, his stoicism -- and that of others; and/or their passive-aggressiveness! -- ruined everybody's lives. Stoner, at least, doesn't go all-out passive-aggressive; he stops short of that. And for that, I could (and did) commend him. But yes, it was an age in which people couldn't speak (or act) out in order to strive for happiness; and conversely it is a novel about situations where people should've (been able to). And that, to me, made it a tragedy to plough through.
Thank you for the reminders and your thoughts.


message 34: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Suden wrote: "Jonathan wrote: "some really wise stuff". (^^,)

I agree with most, if not all of what you said there, Jonathan. I read it too long ago and during a very exciting trip, so I didn't remember everyth..."
Thanks for your input. The comments to my review added a lot of value to my reading.


message 35: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Elyse wrote: "Your little - wonderful- and I mean WONDERFUL brain must need time to rest- yes?
Nobody can spin more thoughts - many - fast - valuable topics and themes - worthy to discuss than you.
On that not..."
thank you again. I saw you are retiring from reviewing...for the nth time. :)) I am sure you wrote that before but I understand why you want to disconnect. Sometimes it becomes an obligation and we all have enough of those. Goodreads and reading should be fun.


Marc Gerstein Your review is spot on Like you, I was really into it at the start. But the spoiler portion of your review pin-pointed the place where it went off the rails and never came back. I just posted a two-star review.


message 37: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Marc Gerstein wrote: "Your review is spot on Like you, I was really into it at the start. But the spoiler portion of your review pin-pointed the place where it went off the rails and never came back. I just posted a two..." Glad I am not the only one who had issues with this novel.


message 38: by Terrie (new)

Terrie  Robinson A very informative review, Adina!


Bianca Splendid! I bought this a while ago, but I'm yet to read it. You made some points which sound like something that would bug me big time as well, but until I read it, I won't be certain. (I'd so love to get my hands on the audiobook).


message 40: by Laura (new) - added it

Laura I bought this last Friday, I hope not to get pissed off as well...


message 41: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Terrie wrote: "A very informative review, Adina!" Thank you, Terrie.


message 42: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Bianca wrote: "Splendid! I bought this a while ago, but I'm yet to read it. You made some points which sound like something that would bug me big time as well, but until I read it, I won't be certain. (I'd so lov..." I listened to this one as well. The narrator does a wonderful job, I think. I am looking forward to reading your thoughts.


message 43: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Laura wrote: "I bought this last Friday, I hope not to get pissed off as well..." Me too.


message 44: by Somormujo (new) - added it

Somormujo Great review Adine
I am very interested in this book, because I have planned to read it along the next months and so your review has been so suitable to me … I preferred not to read the version with spoilers and so I will go with a little less hype I had before.
Thank you for your review !!
Kind regards !!


message 45: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Somormujo wrote: "Great review Adine
I am very interested in this book, because I have planned to read it along the next months and so your review has been so suitable to me … I preferred not to read the version wi..."
I think it is probably better to have less hype. You might like it more.


María Jesús In total agreement with your view on this.


message 47: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina María wrote: "In total agreement with your view on this." i am sorry you did not like this more.


Madalina Moise I do understand your point of view Adina, however as the title itself says it, there's only one main character and the introspection is mainly around it.
I also wished and hoped he had done more for his daughter and was curious how the relationship will develop in between them with time, however if you have paid attention to both Stoner's and his wife's families where they grew up in, both parents encountered communication and intimacy difficulties in their childhoods at home, parent towards child.
With this being said, the harm has been passed from one generation to the next one, but guess would take some psychology insight to notice this.

I absolutely loved the voice of the author and the great and subtle cognitive introspection it shows beginning until the end.


message 49: by Adina (new) - added it

Adina Madalina wrote: "I do understand your point of view Adina, however as the title itself says it, there's only one main character and the introspection is mainly around it.
I also wished and hoped he had done more f..."
i agree with your thoughts. This is why i could not rate the novel. One one hand
I appreciate it, on the other, it made me mad.


Justin Zigenis It’s been a while since I read this, so forgive my possibly foggy recollection. I don’t remember getting the impression that Stoner was supposed to be a hero at all. Isn’t part of the beauty of the book that he was an Everyman, average, didn’t aspire to greatness at all? I had trouble with him not saving his daughter too, but this is an average aspect of men at that time, yes?


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