Discuss: Captain America: The Winter Soldier -Spoiled Edition!

Karen: OK, we've waited an appropriate amount of time -now we can blab about all the great stuff in Captain America:The Winter Soldier! To get the ball rolling, I'll share some email exchanges Doug and I had about the movie. Maybe you can build off that, or share your own thoughts about this great Marvel flick!

SPOILERS!!!!

Doug: Captain America was just wonderful -- what a great superhero movie. As others have remarked, it's in Marvel's top 3 alongside Iron Man and the Avengers. Chris Evans makes me believe that he is Steve Rogers. This screen version of Captain America, although a bit more tolerant of lethal force than I'm used to, is truly how I'd see the character. The increased roles for the Widow and Nick Fury were welcome, and the Falcon was incredibly well-handled. Throw in the Lemurian reference, a Stephen Strange reference, the way they played Arnim Zola and Batroc, Baron Strucker, and three (!) Helicarriers and there was a lot to love.

Karen: I thought you'd love Cap. They really did a fantastic job on the film. I feel like Chris Evans has finally grown into the role -I actually believe him as Cap now. I'm very happy to see that principled character I grew up with up there on the big screen. I really can't fault his performance at all.

Karen: I also was very pleased with the Falcon and how they introduced him. Thankfully he was not an agent of SHIELD! His comics origin would have been too convoluted to use, but I liked what they did, especially the idea that he was counseling returning veterans. And the flying! That was outstanding. His relationship with Cap was perfect too. I loved how they met. And some of his lines -"I do what he does, only slower." -classic.

The whole infiltration of Hydra into SHIELD was a great idea. I've been interested for years in Operation Paperclip and the incorporation of Nazi scientists into our space program and other areas  of government, like post-war intelligence networks, and it's very troubling. It's not that hard to imagine that in a world of super-beings, a group like Hydra could worm its way into a large organization like that. We've been very lukewarm viewers of the Agents of SHIELD show, but I have to say, the way they tied this movie's events into the show was pretty clever. All this does make you wonder how the rest of the films will be affected.

I loved Arnim Zola! Do you see a trend here? Love, love, loved it all!

Doug: I'm a little confused on two things in the first bonus scene, however. Didn't Loki have the scepter with him when he sat on Asgard's throne at the end of the last Thor picture? And, are we to assume that the Maximoff twins will not be mutants but instead genetic constructs of Hydra?

Karen: I thought Loki/Odin was holding Odin's spear at the end of Thor 2, but I'd have to check. As for the twins, I guess this is their workaround for not being able to use the term 'mutant' -they just make them experiments. Did you notice that Pietro's hair was still dark in this scene, but in the pictures from Avengers: Age of Ultron, it is turning white? Maybe as he uses his powers, it will turn white? Also, it seems that perhaps Wanda's powers may be more telekinetic than probability-altering? Perhaps that would be easier for an audience to understand?

Doug: I missed the whole Crossbones thing, but then I have no experience with the character. Was he the main Hydra soldier, that was with Cap in the initial scene and then was the main guy in the control room scene when Agent 13 put a gun to his head?  Also, when Fury was being attacked by the Washington, DC police, did I hear his "Jarvis" say that there were no humans in range? So were they all LMDs?

Karen: Yes, you got it. Brock Rumlow =Crossbones. It will be interesting to see if they put him in his mask. He could be interpreted as  a Bane rip-off by some.

I didn't pick up on the LMD comment. I'll have to listen for that when I see the movie again! (NOTE -On my second viewing, it sounds to me like the AI says "No units in the area," referring to the Metro police).

I thought the scene with Peggy was unnecessary. It didn't actually do anything for the story. They should have either cut it, or built upon it. The only mis-step in the movie, in my opinion. 

Doug: See, I thought the Peggy scene served to cement Cap's "man out of time" element. Looking at how young she was, and how beautiful she was in the first film, it did (for me) hammer home the point that Cap and Bucky would be 95 years old! So for me it worked, because it would later bring the incredulity to Cap when he saw the Winter Soldier unmasked. Of course, at the end of the film we got to see Bucky in a cryogenic chamber in that KGB folder. 

Karen: Don't get me wrong, I like Peggy a lot, and would like to see more of her, but I felt that scene needed more follow up -it felt sort of thrown in there.

Doug: Speaking of, and I need to research this -- didn't the KGB go away when the Soviet Union fell in 1990? If so, it would be difficult for the Widow to be KGB trained, as she'd have been 6 years old.

Karen: I asked the same thing about the Widow to my husband, who just shrugged it off, after the film. We're getting pretty far away from the Soviet era  now. I asked also why the Winter Soldier had the red star on his shoulder if he'd been working for Hydra all these years -or was it  Hydra within the KGB? It is a little confusing but I guess it doesn't prevent me from enjoying the movie.

And how about Cap taking down a whole jet with just his shield? Wasn't that an incredible scene? It gets across the point that he deserves to be a part of the Big Three. That to me felt very much like comic book action.

Doug: So there you have it -- some thoughts from your hosts to get things rolling today. Have at it!
 

Discuss: Captain America: The Winter Soldier

Karen: PLEASE keep it SPOILER-FREE for a few days until folks have  had a chance to see the movie! Thanks!