Discuss: Marvel's Batman Knock-offs

Doug:  Today's post came as a suggestion from an Anonymous reader in a comment left in the Suggestion Box last Sunday.  Thanks!

Shrouded in Mystery, Part 3: Super-Villain Team-Up 7

Super-Villain Team-Up #7 (August 1976)
"Who is... the Shroud?"
Steve Englehart-Herb Trimpe/Pablo Marcos

Doug: OK, now hear this: I am happy to see Pablo Marcos' inks. Yep -- for all the detracting I've done over the past few months, I am telling our readers here and now that ol' Pablo is a savior. I was never happier for my eyes to greet his work.

Karen: Savior? I don't know if I'd go that far. Maybe better than the previous inkers, but honestly, all these issues have been relatively mediocre art-wise. Marcos certainly couldn't be any worse!

Doug: OK, yeah -- so savior might be a tad over-the-top. But he did clean up Trimpe's pencils, and inflect a little dynamism; he also made the faces look less 1950's-ish (if you know what I mean).

Doug: We pick this one up as the FF depart Doom's castle. Doom and Dr. Henry Kissinger (US Secretary of State during the Nixon and Ford administrations) have just signed a non-aggression pact. As per that agreement, the FF is ordered to desist in attacking Doom. Sullen and defeated, the team exits as Doom gloats to himself. Namor is also present, and resigns himself to his situation of slavery to Doom. Author Steve Englehart uses the next several pages as his political pulpit, but to be quite honest, he provides balance. Reed plays the part of the conservative, not wanting change or really to upset the apple cart. Johnny is the flaming liberal (pun intended), while Namor muses to himself as (somewhat surprisingly) a moderate. It's an interesting spectrum, and for the most part well done.

Karen: The political angle is one of the more bizarre elements of what has been a fairly bland story. We get a whole page of the FF arguing about whether to defy the authorities or not. I was amused by Reed saying,"After winning the confidence of every president from Kennedy to Ford, the Fantastic Four is not about to buck the government's decisions!" Boy, I loved those days when the comics were essentially operating in real time! And how about that reference by Johnny, comparing Doom to Hitler? That's certainly not something you see now -but probably for the better. I'm tired of people dragging out Hitler every time they want to besmirch someone.

Doug: As Namor concludes his soliloquy, he is suddenly aware that he is not alone. Stepping from the shadows is the mystery man we've encountered in each of the previous two issues -- the Shroud! The Shroud introduces himself, and then tells Namor his entire backstory. And what do you know? I think we've heard this before! Hey, I don't know if there was a lawsuit back in the day, filed by DC Comics, but there should have been! Wow -- Englehart's not even hiding the fact that he's ripping off Bob Kane and Bill Finger, as this is the exact origin of Bruce Wayne as it's played out over the years. And I thought it just really detracted from the story. Look, I've been taking both Trimpe and Englehart to task during this 3-issue run we've looked at, and today is no exception. There's just a lot here not to like. Don't get me wrong -- this isn't an issue of "it doesn't hold up"; instead, it's just sloppy storytelling.

Karen: Actually I thought that Englehart was ripping off two characters: Batman and Kwai Chang Caine from the TV series Kung Fu! First we get the Batman stuff -the kid who sees his parents gunned down by a thug and swears vengeance. Then he goes off to study at a monastery, gets branded, and runs out into the snow -all like in Kung Fu! Engelhart has already said in a few interviews that he and Jim Starlin were very influenced by that show when they created Shang-Chi. I guess that influence carried over here.

Karen: But the 'borrowing' didn't really bother me. Hey, if you're going to steal, steal from the best! I liked the Shroud, probably precisely because he was so Batman-like. For me, he was the best thing to come out of this storyline.
Doug: So the Shroud announces that his mission is to kill Doom. Namor laughs it off, but the Shroud leaves anyway. Then we get a couple of really strange scenes. We see Doom walking through the streets of Latveria with his hounds, and entering a family home. He declares that he has come to exercise an ages-old right, and requests the daughter of the house. Creeeeee-py! Oh, and what's the deal with Latveria's location? Earlier it was stated that it's in the Balkans; if that's true, it's closer to Austria than Greece, as the family here speaks German. However, in the same scene Doom uses a French phrase. Next, we see the FF speeding home, still arguing, only to have Reed whip the Fantasticar around and head for Hydrobase -- where Namor's allies have holed up. And then we get to a multi-page battle between Doom and the Shroud, where the Shroud comes off, again, as a Batman-clone.

Karen: Doom's claiming of the peasant girl was icky. Luckily the Comics Code was still in place, so it never went much further than Doom ranting at her. Still, it was a little disturbing.
Doug: The story ends with Doom casting away his burning chestplate, only to be attacked by wolves and his hounds and toppled over a cliff to his seeming death. Until you turn to the last page...

Karen: The battle with Doom was fun. I don't know if I really believed for a minute that the Shroud could do so well against Doom, but it was fun to see Doom go down. I think perhaps his over-confidence was what's really on display here. The part where he's attacked by his own dogs and goes over the cliff reminded me of nothing so much as an old Hammer horror film -I could easily visualize Dracula in place of Doom! And the dogs turning on "their master" - it's what the Latverians would like to do, I'm sure, but are too afraid to try. Despite our lackluster reviews, I have to admit, the ending made me want to go get the next issue!

Shrouded in Mystery, Part 2 -- Super-Villain Team-Up 6

Super-Villain Team-Up #6 (June 1976)
"Prisoner!"
Steve Englehart-Herb Trimpe/Jack Abel

Doug: Last time I wrote about my feelings toward the storytelling (words and pictures) in SVTU #5. I have to say, all are still valid as I re-read (for the first time in almost 35 years -- egad!) #6. Englehart's script continues to remind me of a Larry Lieber-style story, and Herb Trimpe's art is stiff. I'll have a specific remark concerning the depiction of Namor coming up.

Karen: I think the Trimpe-Abel team is even more uninspiring than the Trimpe-Perlin team from last issue.

Doug: At the conclusion of our preceding installment, Namor had been forced to pledge his allegiance to Dr. Doom. Doom had ruined Namor's ability to process oxygen, and was holding the antidote away from him. The splash to this issue has Namor behind bars, trapped in a chamber of Castle Doom. He makes no bones about his displeasure, screaming Doom's name and echoing it throughout the castle. Doom finally bursts into the room to chastise his fellow monarch. In a scene straight out of a Mel Brooks movie, Doom reports that he's been spying on Namor through the eyeballs of a portrait on the wall! Doom makes it clear that he is indeed in charge, and storms out.
Karen: Oh man, that thing with the portrait was just terrible -Mel Brooks indeed! I don't know how a talented writer like Englehart could come up with such a stereotypical portrayal of Doom. There are no nuances, no subtleties -he's a complete cartoon villain here.

Doug: Once back in his control room, Doom notices that the Fantastic Four have arrived to rescue Namor. In a much-too-long 4-page battle, the FF are confronted by various defenses to Doom's castle. Finally defeating an android army, our heroes move toward their target. During this spread Johnny spies a black, bird-like jet swooping low and wonders if it might belong to the Shroud. He deduces that it might because the plane is the same color as the Shroud's costume -- now how's that for detective work? Well, it is the Shroud and Namor spies him as well from his cell.

Karen: For a guy who is all about stealth, the Shroud sure gets seen a lot. And deducing that a plane belongs to the Shroud because it is the same color as his costume -which is black I suppose?-...oh boy.

Doug: In the midst of all of this Doom is meeting with a shadowy figure who seems very intent on learning more of Doom's technology, specifically his military technology. They seem to be bargaining, and Doom is told that he may yet achieve superpower status. Who is this guy? Not only is his identity hidden, but Doom addresses him as an equal. No, check that -- Doom almost seems to be on his best behavior because he wants something from this man. But the negotiations, if that's what they are, are suddenly interrupted by one of Doom's lackeys. "Bela" bursts in and tells Doom that the FF are almost to the castle. Wasting no time, Doom finds a nearby monitor and summons Namor to attack!

Karen: As a kid I would have had no idea who Doom's guest was; this time around I was able to figure it out, based on his silhouette. Englehart did like to get political!

Doug: I mentioned a quirk in the art at the top of this post. If you'll notice the panel below (found on story page 15), tell me that Jazzy Johnny Romita didn't draw Namor here?! This style is not found anywhere else in the story. I'm not sure what Trimpe/Abel turned in, but it obviously wasn't up to snuff and I'd imagine that as the printing deadline drew near, JR Sr. in his position as art director did the necessary doctoring-up. Anyway, the FF take Namor down relatively easily. But when they finally enter Castle Doom, who is there to greet them alongside the Doctor but our Secretary of State -- Henry Kissinger! Dr. Kissinger and Dr. Doom had just concluded a non-aggression treaty! Wow -- shades of Stalin and Hitler, and we know how that turned out! But waiting in the wings, literally, is the mysterious Shroud, who seems about to make his presence known. To be continued...

Karen: I could see there might be some 'correction' there, although it doesn't scream Romita to me. Romita definitely re-drew both Reed and Sue's faces on the Starlin/Weiss cover though, and maybe the entire figure of the Torch. It seems like Starlin was always being subjected to having his covers re-touched.
Karen: I'm really not sure where any of this is going. I did read it years ago, but my memories are dim, except for the stuff regarding the Shroud and his origin. Let's hope the next issue is a bit more enjoyable.